CELLAR -- DRAFT MINUTES for Virtual Interim Meeting

Date	Time	Local Times
2022-03-29	21:00 Amsterdam	Time Converter
Note	Meeting time is intentionally anchored to Amsterdam

Administrivia

Logistics for Meeting

INFO:

https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/chair-notes/tree/master/interim-2022-02
Note that we're now pointing to the Github repo for chair notes here

WEB CONFERENCE:

https://meetings.conf.meetecho.com/interim/?short=cfe1fd60-bccc-413f-a57b-fdf3cbf2878b

This link ^^ changes every month. Spencer did not know this.

Please note that the MeetEcho links for 2022 are available at https://gce.conf.meetecho.com/admin-ietf/

Shared HedgeDoc for notetaking: https://notes.ietf.org/notes-cellar-virtual?edit

• Note that if you log in to the IETF datatracker, you'll be able to edit these notes, add your name to attendee lists, etc.
• Please ask Spencer if you have questions.

2022 virtual interim meeting dates

• Please note our 2022 dates listed at https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/cellar/meetings/

Agenda Items

Note Well: https://www.ietf.org/about/note-well/

Roll call

Attendees
* Spencer Dawkins
* Martijn van Beurden
* Michael Richardson
* Reto Kromer
* Steve Lhomme
* Jerome Martinez

Regrets
*

Accept draft minutes from previous meeting (attached below)

• Any objections? Please let us know on the mailing list.
• No Objections, so ...

WG document status update

• draft-ietf-cellar-chapter-codecs-00 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-codec-07 was posted 2021-10-19, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-control-00 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-ffv1-v4-18 was posted 2021-11-27, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-flac-02 was posted 2021-11-01, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-matroska-08 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-tags-07 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists

Milestone review:

• Previous status: Jerome is now able to focus on FFV1-v4, since we've published FFV1.
  ACTION Spencer to send e-mail to DISPATCH when we submit a (small) update. We should wait until we have a bit more text, or bigger issues, to publish as a draft.

• Are we ready to submit a working group draft for EBML updates (errata plus additions) yet? (https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/ebml-specification/tree/corrections-doc)

  • we can still wait for more feedback/bigger changes before submitting anything - ETA is "after we get Matroska out, so we know everything Matroska needs will be covered"
  • also have some implementation/experience reports.

FLAC as Standards Track or Informational

• PR #135 is OK to push
• Closed for now

errata to acknowledge the MP4 registry work for FFV1

• as listed in https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/cellar/kcchQqo6aq2veXijhwVmozQDLCc/.
• Steve will enter errata for this
• Need to add same material for FFV1-V4 but we do this in GitHub, because that's not a published RFC
• https://github.com/FFmpeg/FFV1/blob…master/ffv1.md#matroska-file-format=
• See https://mp4ra.org/#/codecs and search FFV1

?? email on #matroska-user with the subject "[Matroska-users] Video Coding History questions”

• Postponed to April meeting

push matroska-09 and submit it for review to the higher powers

• One remaining issue, and it's unrelated
• Ready to push this one now.
• We'll initiate WGLC and forward email to appropriate mailing lists outside IETF.
• Will be four week WGLC with two-week reminder

publish codec-08 and tags-08 as well since they seem to expire in April

• (but "Codec changes include proper reference to the (renamed) UncompressedFourCC element and AVS3 codec" and "Tags have the new TVDB2 tag")
• will publish when they expire - they're not being WGLCed

FLAC issues - Discussion on the call

• Two new issues, please review
• Issues #145 and #146

Matroska issues - Discussion on the call

• Can defer this and focus on codecs and tags until after WGLC

FFV1 v4 issues - Discussion on the call

• No updates on this call
• We need to discuss directions on the April call

AOB?

*

:::success
NEXT MEETING 2022-04-26 :tada:
:::

CELLAR -- DRAFT AGENDA for Virtual Interim Meeting

Date	Time	Local Times
2022-01-25	21:00 Amsterdam	Time Converter
Note	Meeting time is intentionally anchored to Amsterdam

Administrivia

Logistics for Meeting

INFO:

https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/chair-notes/tree/master/interim-2022-01
Note that we're now pointing to the Github repo for chair notes here

WEB CONFERENCE:

https://meetings.conf.meetecho.com/interim/?short=7c38e939-3eaf-451e-8fde-8d05e4bd88c8

Shared COMIMD for notetaking: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-cellar-virtual

• Note that if you log in to the IETF datatracker, you'll be able to edit these notes, add your name to attendee lists, etc.
• Please ask Spencer if you have questions.
  :::warning
  The ComiMD URL is still redirecting, but the newly official location is https://notes.ietf.org/notes-cellar-virtual?edit - and that's active now. Please bookmark the new one when you're redirected to it.
  :::

2022 virtual interim meeting dates

• Please note our 2022 dates listed at https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/cellar/meetings/

Agenda Items

Note Well: https://www.ietf.org/about/note-well/

Roll call

Attendees
* Martijn van Beurden
* Michael Richardson
* Steve Lhomme
* Michael Niedermayer
* Jérôme Martinez

Regrets
* Spencer Dawkins (will be 30 min late)

Accept draft minutes from previous meeting (attached below)

• Any objections? Please let us know on the mailing list.
• No objections on the mailing list or on the call.

WG status update

• draft-ietf-cellar-chapter-codecs-00 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-codec-07 was posted 2021-10-19, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-control-00 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-ffv1-v4-18 was posted 2021-11-27, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-flac-02 was posted 2021-11-01, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-matroska-08 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists
• draft-ietf-cellar-tags-07 was posted 2021-10-09, in ID Exists

Milestone review:

• Previous status: Jerome is now able to focus on FFV1-v4, since we've published FFV1.
  ACTION Spencer to send e-mail to DISPATCH when we submit a (small) update. We should wait until we have a bit more text, or bigger issues, to publish as a draft.

• Are we ready to submit a working group draft for EBML updates (errata plus additions) yet? (https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/ebml-specification/tree/corrections-doc)

  • we can still wait for more feedback/bigger changes before submitting anything - ETA is "after we get Matroska out, so we know everything Matroska needs will be covered"
  • also have some implementation/experience reports.
• Discussion about what is an Internet Standard.
  • it is actually quite an old format, a lot of implementations.
    • but for many implementations, there will be no updates, but the current files play just fine.

Matroska issues - Discussion on the call

• merged a few pull requests
• merged/rewrote the time work, defined different ticks for each time base
  • was trying to sample/presized timestamps. Could work, but would never be backwards compatible. So, removed that part, and simplified the result.
    • got some comments, but it is ready.
    • some bugs, but already fixed.
• https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/matroska-specification/pull/577 more review needed.
• https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/matroska-specification/pull/578 generated IANA Considerations.
  • does not generate unassigned for gaps
  • "Any values not mentioned in this table are unassigned"
• https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/matroska-specification/pull/521 needs to be merged (timebase)
• https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/matroska-specification/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+project%3Aietf-wg-cellar%2Fmatroska-specification%2F1+-label%3Amatroska-v5+-label%3A%22control+track%22 this is the list of things that need to be fixed before the document can be finished.
  • also: PRs: https://github.com/ietf-wg-cellar/matroska-specification/pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen+project%3Aietf-wg-cellar%2Fmatroska-specification%2F1+-label%3Amatroska-v5+-label%3A%22control+track%22+sort%3Acreated-desc

FLAC issues - Discussion on the call

• Discussion about Examples, and Numerical Considerations Appendix.
• Martijn will merge some items and close some dead issues and post a new version soon.

FFV1 v4 issues - Discussion on the call

• No progress to discuss.

AOB?

• EBML query from Martijn!

:::success
NEXT MEETING 2022-02-22 :tada:
:::