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Minutes interim-2024-cellar-04: Tue 20:00

Meeting Minutes Codec Encoding for LossLess Archiving and Realtime transmission (cellar) WG
Date and time 2024-02-27 20:00
Title Minutes interim-2024-cellar-04: Tue 20:00
State Active
Other versions markdown
Last updated 2024-02-27


CELLAR -- DRAFT AGENDA for Virtual Interim Meeting

| Date | Time | Local Times |
| :-: :-: :-
| 2024-02-27 21:00 Amsterdam | Time Converter | |
| Note | Meeting time is anchored to Amsterdam | |


**Note that we're now pointing to the Github repo for chair notes here**


note that chat is now Zulip:
but is accessible via meetecho interface.

Shared HedgeDoc for notetaking

Now using the Datatracker assigned notepad at:
  • Note that if you log in to the IETF datatracker, you'll be able to
    edit/clarify/correct these notes, add your name to attendee lists,

  • Please ask Michael or Spencer if you have questions.

2024 virtual interim meeting dates

Agenda Items

Note Well:
Please be KIND to each other.

Roll call


  • Spencer Dawkins
  • Steve Lhomme
  • Jérôme Martinez
  • Martijn van Beurden
  • Michael Niedermayer
  • Michael Richardson (late)
  • Dave Rice
  • Bytebuddy (our mystery guest)

Accept draft minutes from previous meeting

  • Jerome has reviewed, and they are fine ... accepted.

WG status update

| Draft | State | Date Posted | Plans |
| :- :- :- :-
| draft-ietf-cellar-chapter-codecs-04 | ID Exists | 2024-01-27 | |
| draft-ietf-cellar-codec-12 | ID Exists | 2024-01-27 | |
| draft-ietf-cellar-control-04 | ID Exists | 2024-01-27 | |
| draft-ietf-cellar-ffv1-v4-22 | ID Exists | 2024-01-17 | |
| draft-ietf-cellar-flac-14 | IESG Evaluation::AD Followup | 2024-01-14 | |
| draft-ietf-cellar-matroska-21 | RFC Ed Queue | 2023-10-22 | |
| draft-ietf-cellar-tags-12 | ID-Exists | 2023-10-22 | |

Milestone review:

Next steps for additional Matroska specifications

  • which document to start on next?
  • How is the main Matroska document coming along? It is in EDIT state
    now, so it's actively being worked on, but it is also 167 pages, so
    it's not surprising that's taking some time.
  • The current publication queue is here - we're #2 in line
  • Michael and Spencer will follow up after IETF 119 if we haven't
    heard from the RFC Editor by then
  • From last meeting minutes

    • draft-ietf-cellar-tags should be fastest - 2024-12?
    • draft-ietf-cellar-codec should be next, and is important -
    • Could different documents have different leads?
    • Could we have multiple codec documents (for different codecs)?
    • Perhaps one document for existing major codecs? MPEG 1/2/4 AVC
    • and HEVC, AV1 (perhaps in another document) MPEG 1/2 Audio Layer
    • 1/2/3 AAC PCM OPUS Vorbis AC3 DTS FLAC (FLAC has Matroska
    • mapping in its own RFC already!) Text SSA/ASS SRT WebVTT
    • Spencer and Michael will update the milestones in datatracker
  • To reference Matroska, we reference draft -21, and the RFC Editor
    converts the reference to an RFC when they have a number assigned.

FLAC IESG ballot

  • Murray is checking with the IESG to see how he should proceed about
    the new normative reference added during IESG Evaluation
  • He'll ask at the IESG telechat this coming Thursday
  • FLAC stays in AD Follow-up for now


  • "Why Cellar?"
  • Michael sent a short note with a quote from the Library of Congress
    to the mailing list
  • Would someone like to write a short note about Matroska being
    elevated as an archival format?
  • Martijn is willing to write a short, cheery note about this major
    milestone for the working group - interview Dave, quotes from
  • From Dave = "Kate Murray at Library of Congress would likely offer a
    quote, but in her govt role it would be rather factual"
  • This is IETF-wide, but also for people outside the IETF (for
    example, ISOC)
  • Martijn will do a first draft and send it to the mailing list
  • This will be most helpful if we have a draft by the time Matroska is

IETF119 is in Brisbane, March 16 to 22.
Next meeting is 2024-04-09. (No March meeting, two April meetings)