2020-10-27: Minutes
slides-interim-2021-ietfieee-09-sessa-2020-10-27-minutes-00

Minutes of the  2020-10-27 IETF-IEEE 802 Coordination Teleconference

1. Welcome, roll call, agenda bashing

Present:

- Alissa Cooper
- Alvaro Retana
- Cindy Morgan
- Dan Romascanu
- Donald Eastlake
- Dorothy Stanley
- Eric Vyncke
- Glenn Parsons
- Janos Farkas
- Jiankang Yao
- Jodi Haasz
- Jon Rosdahl
- Juan Carlos Zinnga
- Magnus Westerlund
- Martin Duke
- Mirja Kuehlewind
- Pascal Thubert
- Paul Congdon
- Paul Nikolich
- Robert Wilton
- Roman Danyliw
- Russ Housley
- Scott Mansfield
- Warren Kumari


2. Action item updates

  - Done/OBE:

    o Bob Heile to send a short description of 802's LPA project with 
      pointers to Russ Housley for inclusion in the coordination list.
      <http://www.ieee802.org/15/pub/TG4w.html>

      + Pat Kinney reported via email that IEEE 802.15.4w incorporates a 
        split-mode, lower data rates, and additional low-rate forward 
        error correction codes, including a powerful low density parity 
        check (LDPC) code, to achieve robust radio communication over 
        links with high link budget requirements and strong 
        interference.

    o Bob Heile to email the coordination list once 802.15.4w is 
      published. Once it is published, item 31 on the coordination list
      can be closed.

      + 802.15.4w has been published 
        <https://standards.ieee.org/standard/802_15_4w-2020.html>.

    o Glenn Parsons to send the details of the rejected 802.1Qcz port 
      requests to Magnus Westerlund.

      + Glenn Parsons reported that 802.1Qcz decided to proceed with an 
        alternative.

  - Updated:

    o Pat Kinney to provide a status update on 802.15.12.
      (Originally added 2019-06-18; updated 2020-10-27)

      Pat Kinney reported via email that 802.15.12 has stalled due to 
      lack of attendance. 

  - In Progress:

    o Scott Mansfield and Rob Wilton to get IEEE and IETF people 
      together to brainstorm a way forward that will allow exact 
      match string comparison for MAC addresses.
      (Added 2020-06-15)


3. IETF New Work summary

  - Applications and Real-Time

    o A Semantic Definition Format for Data and Interactions of Things 
      (ASDF)

      This new WG was chartered on 2020-10-14. See
      https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/asdf/about/

    o  Building Blocks for HTTP APIs (HTTPAPI)

      This new WG was chartered on 2020-10-23. See
      https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/httpapi/about/

    o JSONPath WG (jsonpath)

      This new WG was chartered on 2020-10-23. See
      https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/jsonpath/about/

  - Internet

    o MAC Address Device Identification for Network and Application 
      Services (MADINAS)

      The MADINAS BOF was tentatively approved for IETF 109, pending a 
      more streamlined scope to focus on one use case. The IESG will 
      make the final determination about whether to proceed on 
      2020-10-29.

      MADINAS is a non-WG-forming BOF to determine if there is support 
      in the IETF community to define best practices, update any 
      existing documents if needed, or potentially develop new protocols 
      or mechanisms for service continuity in the presence of MAC 
      Address randomization. One of the agenda items for MADINAS is a 
      short history of the work on this that has been done in IEEE 802.

  - Routing

    o Application-aware Networking (APN)

      The APN BOF was tentatively approved for IETF 109, pending a 
      more streamlined scope to focus on one use case. The IESG will 
      make the final determination about whether to proceed on 
      2020-10-29.

      Russ Housley noted that there may be overlap between the IETF and 
      IEEE 802 here. Most of this is at the network layer, but it will 
      depend on the attributes at the link layer to provide those 
      services.


4. 802 New Work summary

4.1. 802 New Work summary November 2020

  - 802.1

    o 802.1DP Standard: Time-Sensitive Networking Profile for Aerospace 
      Onboard Ethernet Communications

      Glenn Parsons reported that this is the latest set of profiles for 
      TSN, specifically for aerospace. There has been some collaboration 
      with IETF here on deterministic networking.

  - 802.11

    o 802.11bh Amendment: Enhanced service with randomized MAC 
      addresses

      Dorothy Stanley reported that this PAR will look at the way MAC 
      addresses are currently used and define new mechanisms for 
      identifiers, given MAC address randomization, without decreasing 
      user privacy. There is potential for overlap with work in the IETF 
      MADINAS BOF. 

      A report on this from last year is available at: 
      https://mentor.ieee.org/802.11/dcn/19/11-19-1442-09-0rcm-rcm-tig-draft-report-outline.odt

    o 802.11bi Amendment: Enhanced service with Data Privacy Protection

      Dorothy Stanley reported that this PAR amendment specifies new 
      mechanisms to improve user privacy for the 802.11 MAC 
      specification. This may be of interest to the IETF.

  - 802.15

    o 802.15.4aa Amendment: Japanese Rate Extension

      This PAR amendment defines a data rate extension of SUN FSK PHY to 
      IEEE Std 802.15.4-2020. It adds data rate extensions for the SUN 
      FSK modulation and channel parameters. These extensions focus on 
      the Japanese frequency band.

  - 802.16

    o 802.16t Amendment - Fixed and Mobile Wireless Access in Narrowband 
      Channels

      This PAR modification expands the scope for the Standard for Air 
      Interface for Broadband Wireless Access Systems Fixed and Mobile 
      Wireless Access in Narrowband Channels.

  - Other

    Dorothy Stanley noted that in addition to the PARs for the November 
    meeting, 802.11 will request approval of the P802.11REVme Revision 
    PAR.


4.2. 802 New Work summary August 2020

  - 802.1

    o 802.1ASdn Amendment: YANG Data Model

      Glenn Parsons reported that this amendment specifies a YANG data 
      model that allows configuring and state reporting for all managed 
      objects of the base standard. This amendment specifies a Unified 
      Modeling Language (UML)-based figure to explain the managed 
      objects and the associated YANG data model.

    o Other

      Glenn Parsons noted that 802.1 intends to withdraw 802.1D, which 
      has been replaced by 802.1Q. There are a number of references that 
      will need to be updated, including to IETF documents. 802.1 is 
      working to identify the affected documents, and plans to send a 
      liaison about this to IETF.

  - 802.3

    o 802.3 Industry Connections - New Ethernet Applications

      Dorothy Stanley reported that this activity is to get interested 
      parties together to identify the areas where work is needed.

  - 802.11

    o 802.11bf  Amendment: Wireless Local Area Sensing (SENS)

      Dorothy Stanley reported that this PAR amendment defines 
      modifications to the IEEE 802.11 medium access control layer (MAC) 
      and to the Directional Multi Gigabit (DMG) and enhanced DMG (EDMG) 
      PHYs to enhance Wireless Local Area Network (WLAN) sensing (SENS) 
      operation in license-exempt frequency bands between 1 GHz and 
      7.125 GHz and above 45 GHz.

      Paul Nikolich noted that this may have some implications with 
      regards to privacy, so IETF may want to keep an eye on it.

5. Review current coordination items

  - Item 5. Enabling use of Local Addresses for virtualization and IoT

    Janos Farkas reported that IEEE 802.1CQ completed task group ballot 
    and is in the middle of ballot resolution. There have been major 
    technical changes to the document. 

  - Item 21. 6tisch

    Pascal Thubert reported that work in the 6TISCH WG has completed. 
    This coordination item will be closed.

  - Item 24. Coordination between the IETF and IEEE 802 on Pervasive 
    Monitoring

    Glenn Parsons reported that 802E has been approved and is currently 
    being edited for publication. This coordination item will be closed 
    once 802E is published.

  - Item 25. Layer 2/Layer 3 Interaction for Time-Sensitive Traffic

    Janos Farkas reported that most of the relevant IETF documents have 
    either been published or are in the RFC Editor Queue. For the 
    remaining documents, people on both sides are participating in the 
    discussions. Janos will send emails encouraging people to review the 
    documents when they reach the IETF Last Call or IEEE Letter Ballot 
    stages.

    Janos Farkas noted that the DETNET WG was rechartered before IETF 
    108 to include the controller plane.

  - Item 27. Development of YANG models in the IEEE 802

    Scott Mansfield reported that all of the metadata has been added to 
    the IEEE YANG modules in yangcatalog.org.

  - Item 31. LPWAN

    Paul Nikolich reported that IEEE 802.15.4w has been published. This 
    coordination item will be closed.

  - Item 32. Source Address Validation for Wireless LAN

    Pascal Thubert reported that draft-ietf-6lo-ap-nd is currently in 
    the RFC Editor Queue. This coordination item will be closed.

  - Item 33. Capability Discovery

    Janos Farkas reported that the first Task Group ballot has closed, 
    and that TSN will start comment resolution during their November 
    meeting.

    Alvaro Retana reported that LSVR has not made much progress because 
    they have been focusing on the core specification. He hopes this 
    will get back on track after IETF 109.

  - Item 34. Reliable and Available Wireless (RAW)

    Pascal Thubert reported that RAW has a number of documents 
    explaining the technology, but that the main document has not yet 
    been adopted by the working group.

  - Possible New Coordination Items

    No new coordination items were added to the list.


6. November/March meeting plans

  Russ Housley noted that both IETF and IEEE 802 are planning to hold 
  virtual meetings for the foreseeable future. The group agreed that 
  there was no need for an additional meeting before the next regularly-
  scheduled conference call in February 2021.


7. Adjourn