[{"author": "justus", "text": "I cannot reach the conferencing tool
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:00:25Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "it pongs, but http requests time out
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:00:47Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "'morning o/
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:00:58Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "I don't think there is anything I can do from my end, you'll have to make due without me, sorry
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:02:03Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "am I seeing it correctly that the video stream requires credentials?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:03:17Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "muelli: i think that's correct.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:04:50Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "if you have a datatracker login registered for the meeting, you can find the stream at https://wws.conf.meetecho.com/conference/?group=openpgp
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:05:18Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "dkg: thanks.  I've tried to register, but their email is probably greylisted for the moment :-
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:06:45Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "I've found audio, but it doesn't seem to be working: https://icecast-ietf.conf.meetecho.com:8443/
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:07:01Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "I'm seeing 8 people have read it.  52 in Meetecho.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:10:36Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "There is a slight echo from the room
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:01Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "@Meetecho -- anything you can do to help?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:20Z"}, {"author": "Randy Bush", "text": "soudns fine on meetecho
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:21Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "https://icecast-ietf.conf.meetecho.com:8443/parksuite9.mp3
actually works.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:25Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "I hear the echo via meetecho
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:33Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "i alos hear the echo via meetecho
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:43Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "I also hear the echo
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:44Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@remote (or onsite) folks: please jump in the queue for clarifying questions or other comments
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:49Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "also echo here
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:11:56Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@dkg do you need to end the poll? it's still on screen in the room
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:12:44Z"}, {"author": "Meetecho", "text": "We'll send someone to check
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:13:00Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "dkg: can you kill / close the  hand raising thing. it is overlaying the presentation slides :(
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:13:18Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "@Meetecho -- thank you
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:13:51Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "dkg: good. it is fixed now
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:14:27Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "I figured it out:-)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:14:51Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Sorry, there is no such implementaion for GnUPG.  What Gniibe did are experimets to understand that new thing.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:17:30Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@werner: did you want that on the mic? (and hence recorded?)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:17:58Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Its fro the records.  The slide is factual wrong here.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:18:43Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "if anyone who can't send audio wants me to replay something to the room/recording, just preface your comment here with \"mic:\"
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:20:25Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "i guess if there is an interoperable implementation, there have to be at least two ? :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:21:30Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Please recall that AEAD has been defined in January 2018 and since then deployed.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:22:57Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "@paul: we have two (OpenPGP.js and patched gopenpgp, though the latter is more of a hack than a branch)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:23:31Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "With several 100k Users usuing it daily.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:23:43Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "And of course it's possible that I implemented it wrong twice, so certainly it would be better to have another implementation to check :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:23:59Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@werner: are you able to send audio? sounds like it'd be good to raise your last above wrt AEAD at the end of Justus' slides?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:24:49Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Sure
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:24:53Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "great
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:24:58Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "no one claimed the interoperable implementations were independent :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:25:04Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "Hmhm :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:25:13Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Also video ;-)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:25:14Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "video's great, but audio wins:-)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:25:37Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Need to save some bandwidth
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:25:53Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "OCB as MUST is great.  Having a FIPS mode is something I would have proposed anyway due to the current state of the FIPS algo discussions
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:30:37Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "good!
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:30:50Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "is there a reason that the secret key algorithm is limited to AES-128 (in contrast to AES-256)?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:30:54Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "AES-256 is there, but not mandatory to implement
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:31:32Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "Andreas Huelsing_web_547: AES-128 is just MTI - AES-256 is still supported :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:31:35Z"}, {"author": "g\u65b0\u90e8 \u88d5", "text": "My understanding: AEADv1 is orthogonal to SEIPDv2.  GnuPG and rnp can work with AEADv1 packet.  AEADv1 is not defined in crypto-refresh-05.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:31:38Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "Great, thanks
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:31:47Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "Audio has just gotten much better. Thanks to whoever made this.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:18Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "+1
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:24Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "he's very quiet
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:40Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "yes
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:41Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "we can hear you, but it's quiet
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:41Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "quiet
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:43Z"}, {"author": "Benson Muite", "text": "yes
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:44Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "that's much butter
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:35:45Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "lesson is: wearing mask => speak close to mic
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:36:31Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "The lesson is: Never use GCM ;-)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:37:10Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Its just FIPS which likes it.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:37:18Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "reality though is that lotsa people (are forced to) like FIPS
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:37:37Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": ":-( - I known
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:37:51Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "This is also a potential concern for any other AEAD mode -- having a robust key separation method avoids the problem in general.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:37:51Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@werner please feel free to respond (or whomever)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:38:21Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "how would dropping aes_gcm not endanger the backwards compatiblity of gnupg's AEAD that uses aes_gcm ??
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:39:31Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "ic: No. It would just be dropping EAX
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:41:09Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "afaik, the backup cipher for AES-128 with NIST is AES-256
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:42:06Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "we can hear you Paul
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:43:50Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "mic: okay
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:44:33Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "we can hear you
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:45:38Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Best practise is anyway to put just the mail address into the user id.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:48:34Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Technical required data so no GDPR concerns
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:49:00Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "you could loosen the requirement, though.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:51:00Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@werner: I guess part of this question is whether, for v5 keys, we do consider including mail address as best practise or not
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:51:10Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "The whole idea of PGG 2 to OpenPGP was to require a self-signed user-id.  It was a backward compatible thing that we had no such requirement in the RFC.  That can and should of course be dropped.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:51:22Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "Werner: should the \"no requirement\" requirement be dropped? eg you are saying it should become mandatory ?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:52:45Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "if anyone is interested in signing e-mail headers, please join LAMPS on Friday
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:52:47Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "we'll be discussing draft-ietf-lamps-header-protection there, which explicitly contemplates S/MIME but should be applicable to PGP/MIME as well.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:53:25Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "At least it should be a SHOULD.  I would like a MUST but Derek once explained that for some minor implemntations there is no space for it.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:54:09Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "the \"no space\" question wasn't one the DT considered in this context
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:54:48Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Thus the self-signature should be a MUST
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:55:17Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "daniel huigens: is this proposal about all OpenPGP certificates, or just those certificates with a v5 primary key?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:55:58Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@werner: I'd be interested in your argument for why inclusion of user-id (likely containing an email addr) isn't less privacy friendly than not including (not in GDPR terms just general privacy)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:56:00Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "For mail a user-id is required anyway (containing the mail address)
For other data some ther identifier is often used.
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:57:33Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "if the certificate is gathered by WKD, why would the recipient need to see a User ID?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:58:03Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "(if it's verified by the WKD fetch itself)
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:58:13Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@werner: you mean necessary for searching for public keys based on email addr?
", "time": "2022-03-21T09:58:18Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "and comparing the mail sender to the key.  Requirement in many policies
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:02:22Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "ack
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:02:38Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "Not a comment on the technical part of the proposal.  I'm the new responsible AD and still getting up to speed.  I will need to chat offline with the chairs on the charter assessment.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:03:11Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "Roman Danyliw_web_994: thanks, that would be great
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:04:02Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@roman: sure
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:04:38Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "RFC 4880 didn't say anything about the user ID packet having any particular length (it also didn't prohibit a zero-length User ID)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:05:25Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "pgp 2.6.3ia I think started to require self-signatures.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:05:33Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "keep human presentation of the fingerprint to the implementations.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:07:59Z"}, {"author": "Florence D", "text": "Werner, would you be able to summarise your comment from the issue before in the notes?  We didn't catch it (sorry)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:08:06Z"}, {"author": "Florence D", "text": "It's ok, Daniel is on it
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:08:41Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "self-signature?
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:08:43Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@florence: action on chairs to start thread on list with options: a) the \"tentative proposal\" or b) the status quo (possiblly better documented)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:09:11Z"}, {"author": "Florence D", "text": "Done
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:10:33Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Formatting the fingerprint depends on the UI - maybe suggest an option to show the fingerprint as hex digits.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:10:56Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "I'm here
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:01Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "oh sorry, didn't see ya in the list
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:15Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "But you should work this out before you come to me
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:22Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "Comparing fingerprints is also not a PGP specific issue. Is there any proposal that may be worth considering?
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:23Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "+1 to Daniel
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:27Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "You can't read a QR code over the phone.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:37Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@mallory: we won't figure this one out today;-(
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:46Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "In the queue on this issue, not my pres
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:11:57Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "ack
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:12:03Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "It woudl be good to do a check
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:13:30Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "signal's \"security code\" is also pairwise, not per-participant
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:13:33Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "Correct
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:08Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "my experience talking to users of secure messaging apps is that no one is actually verifying fingerprints at all \ud83d\ude1b
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:08Z"}, {"author": "muelli", "text": "I'd say the OpenPGP spec sholdn't concern itself with the verification of key material but rather describe how it's serialised on the wire.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:12Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@dkg: thats what I do (or don't do)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:25Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "Interestingly WhatsApp went with base 10 (for ux reasons ?)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:25Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "Ah signal does the same
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:46Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "Thom Wiggers_web_145: yes, i think that more people know (and can distinguish) the arabic numerals than all of the hex digits.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:14:50Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "might also match the language used better (\u2018security numbers\u2019)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:15:29Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "My point is not that messaging apps are doing it better, but that this effort should align with (perhaps) imperfect UX implementations elsewhere.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:15:38Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "++
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:15:46Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "Fwiw, I would be in favor for rechartering for this work and other work
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:16:57Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "i would even think think of rechartering only after we pass WGLC  since lots of people will wake up only at WGLC
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:23:29Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "there they are!
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:24:21Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "note that https://gitlab.com/openpgp-wg/rfc4880bis/-/issues/101 covers this topic generally
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:25:19Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "sure let's all just use rainbow, what could possibly go wrong? :-)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:26:21Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "it's worth noting that some of the changes to the v5 keys in the current crypto-refresh draft were designed to accomodate larger cryptographic objects, in expectation that PQ algorithms might require larger keys
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:26:45Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "did we?
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:00Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "we changed the signature subpacket area sizes
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:20Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "don't think we did that for keys
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:27Z"}, {"author": "Roman Danyliw", "text": "Per LAMPS, yes it has a number of PQC charter items
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:36Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "justus: sorry, you're right that it's v5 signatures, not v5 keys
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:42Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "stateful hashes are extremely scary in this application imo
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:54Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "notably, we didn't lift the size restrictions that the MPI representation brings
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:28:55Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "not all pubkeys expect MPI in all places
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:29:21Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "true
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:29:27Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "(ecdsa and ecdh expect a non-MPI OID)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:29:36Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "That one of the reasons why we proposed the SOS but in any case there is no need to use MPIs.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:29:50Z"}, {"author": "Stavros Kousidis", "text": "We will focus on stateless signatures for OpenPGP (in the project), but Linux Distributions might have use cases f\u00fcr stateful hash-based signatues. Actually this is a ppoint that we would like input on from the openpgp wg.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:30:37Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "i lean twoard new pubkey algorithms should probably use \"raw\" (or \"native\") formats for pubkey material where possible
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:30:41Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@thom: yeah that's what I'd have thought too (about stateful sigs)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:30:48Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "@sftcd-x There are companies that implemented the stateful hash-based signatures for software updates. This wouldtypically be an application that would be happy about PGP support. Given the missing standards, these are right now only proprietary
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:31:25Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "personal (biased) opinion: mid-2024 is way too early to know we're standardising the right stuff in PQC-space
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:31:44Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "@andreas: yep, I just wondered if any package mgr type things using pgp had look at stateful sigs
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:32:30Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "NISTs call for new submissions to the signature schemes will probably only just be getting started by then I think
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:32:42Z"}, {"author": "Andreas Huelsing", "text": "--> that is why we propose to do multi-algorithm schemes (i.e., combining lattice with ECDH)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:32:57Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "Thanks, Falko!
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:33:03Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "What about Applebaum/DJBs work on PQC for OpenPGP?  Any news?
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:33:31Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "Werner: do you have a link for that work?
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:36:20Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "No,  personal communication quite some time ago.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:36:40Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "I was just curious
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:36:49Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "Falko Strenzke_web_264: your mic is still hot
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:36:52Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "section 1.a could be dozens of pages;-)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:42:42Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "e2ee@ietf.org
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:46:48Z"}, {"author": "Thom Wiggers", "text": "Nice and important work!
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:47:41Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "Thank you! We need more engagement if we are to move the work forward.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:47:57Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "thanks for presenting
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:48:15Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "Mallory Knodel_web_924: thanks for working on this, and raising it to the group
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:48:18Z"}, {"author": "Mallory Knodel", "text": "Appreciate the time on the agenda, Stephen and Daniel.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:48:30Z"}, {"author": "paulwouters", "text": "mumbles openpgpkey DNSSEC records as third party check on WKD :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:49:10Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "\"everyone\" meaning every domain owner?
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:51:17Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "ok, so could be cross-domain
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:51:36Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "@dkg potentially, it's still open for debate
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:51:45Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "sounded more like the things like CT-logs
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:51:52Z"}, {"author": "sftcd-x", "text": "availability is a bit of a deal for those
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:52:07Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "paulwouters: Get the browser vendors on board and the ISPs to allow adding keys to the zone.  That is the major hassle - thus the idea to get back to the easier deployable web key direcory
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:52:12Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "@sftcd-x yeah, it's quite similar
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:52:15Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "Adding stuff to a web server is an easy thing for everyone with a website.  Change the zone is not.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:53:30Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "For clarity, we (ProtonMail) are not proposing a specific implementation for standardization here, it's more an idea at this point that might warrant discussion & potential standardization
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:53:56Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "(Even though we do have a specific implementation, it's somewhat specific to ProtonMail and a general implementation / standard would probably look a bit different)
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:54:50Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "SCNR to post this note on PQC as well as some other ideas:
  In the meantime, while everyone's fixated on patching the theoretical
  mousehole in the corner, they're conveniently avoiding addressing the
  fact that entire walls of the barn are missing elsewhere.
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:55:09Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "I'd like to see ProtonMail simply certifying userid bindings
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:55:24Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "i understand that the goals are slightly different, but at least this would be immediately useful for existing implementations
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:55:43Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "@dkg I think simply putting a certificate in there could also work
", "time": "2022-03-21T10:57:38Z"}, {"author": "dkg", "text": "thanks all!
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:05Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "@justus we could certify User IDs, but indeed the goal here is for the user to detect if ProtonMail (or any keyserver) serves a malicious key for their email address
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:06Z"}, {"author": "Quynh Dang", "text": "Thank you all.
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:10Z"}, {"author": "Daniel Huigens", "text": "Thanks all!
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:17Z"}, {"author": "Benson Muite", "text": "Thanks, useful discussion
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:17Z"}, {"author": "Werner", "text": "cu
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:21Z"}, {"author": "Aron Wussler", "text": "Thanks, bye!
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:23Z"}, {"author": "Florence D", "text": "Can people check they're correctly paraphrased in the notes please?  Thanks
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:28Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "Daniel Huigens_web_611: please start with that ;)
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:41Z"}, {"author": "justus", "text": "Thanks :)
", "time": "2022-03-21T11:01:59Z"}]