In Shenzhen, can hear Jen, Eric, and Tim fine.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:01:39.000Z"}, {"author": "Lars Eggert", "text": "michael, three rooms and we basically voted. top three sessions get rooms.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:03:06.000Z"}, {"author": "Lars Eggert", "text": "~40 people in tokyo, only hub i know of
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:03:31.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "thanks Dave
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:04:19.000Z"}, {"author": "Dave Plonka", "text": "aside re:note taking, my ability to type in the HedgeDoc has stopped; when i type there it does nothing (cursor does not move) either embedded in Meetecho or opened in a separate window.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:19:08.000Z"}, {"author": "Dave Plonka", "text": "OK, working again. whew
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:19:25.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "from charter \"platform-specific or
\ndeployment-specific considerations should be included in the core algorithm
\ndocument\"
but also \"While the algorithm may apply to scenarios
\nwith multiple network links, or pools of multiple connections, specific
\nmechanisms for such scenarios are out of scope for the working group\"
I don't see that _mentioning_ multiple interfaces as a side issue is forbidden by the charter. Solving multihoming in general is a disaster area, but that isn't what this does.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:25:46.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "we do have some text in the doc about VPN issues, in 8.5.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:36:12.000Z"}, {"author": "Philipp Tiesel", "text": "+1 to Lorenzo's proposal to mention PvD issue and remove Interfaces
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:37:34.000Z"}, {"author": "Jen Linkova", "text": "Yes. I think it's a very good idea. It makes the scope exolicit
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:41:33.000Z"}, {"author": "altanai", "text": "does any one have the link to the research paper that was mentioned to have compared the implementations?
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:44:47.000Z"}, {"author": "Nidhi Jaju", "text": "https://arxiv.org/pdf/2412.00263
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:45:26.000Z"}, {"author": "altanai", "text": "TY Nidhi
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:46:44.000Z"}, {"author": "Mirja K\u00fchlewind", "text": "Actually would be interesting to understand what people wouldn\u2019t implement and why
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:53:30.000Z"}, {"author": "Dave Plonka", "text": "Re: @mirja's comment, it would be interesting to know why HEv2 was found to be unimplemented except by one browser (Safari) per the TU-Munich research paper linked above.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:56:32.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "if you want to ask specific questions please go ahead, or we can ask for you.
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:58:55.000Z"}, {"author": "Dave Plonka", "text": "My assumption is that people thought it was complicated and/or low priority (in browsers in recent years, perhaps because IPv6 brokenness has declined, e.g., in commercial ISPs.)
", "time": "2026-03-18T01:59:10.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "but now of course it's not just about v4/v6
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:00:19.000Z"}, {"author": "Dave Plonka", "text": "agreed, and (potentially) even more complicated.
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:01:24.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "indeed
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:01:34.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "reminds me a bit of how RFC 9002 defines various algorithms related to QUIC loss detection and CC
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:03:40.000Z"}, {"author": "Tommy Pauly", "text": "Yeah this is like loss and recovery algorithms
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:03:59.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "so theres an implemention that piick an mixing different things, with different tunables. Its nice to have an algorithm that is just 1 line of pseudocode, even though it doesn't mean much in total isolation e.g. https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc9002#section-6.2.1
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:05:27.000Z"}, {"author": "altanai", "text": "interestingly there was a IRTF talk about this
\nWhat IPv6 RFCs Don\u2019t Say About VPNs
\nHow missing guidance led to IPv6 de-preference
\n", "time": "2026-03-18T02:06:46.000Z"}, {"author": "Bing Sun", "text": "\n", "time": "2026-03-18T02:10:03.000Z"}, {"author": "Lars Eggert", "text": "\"We notice that with VPNs, v6 is often de-preferred severely\"
\n
So technically, \"MUST\" means \"you need to implement it in this way to be able to claim conformance to this RFC\". So we're fine :-)
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:13:03.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "FWIW, I don't _want_ everyone to implement the same client behavior. That would be boring. We should have experimentation and diversity.
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:15:12.000Z"}, {"author": "Lars Eggert", "text": "@Ben I think there is no danger of that :-)
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:16:05.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "the way the draft is written is more bcp-like than a strict spec.
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:16:07.000Z"}, {"author": "altanai", "text": "yet +1 to your suggestion to add sample implementation algorithms
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:16:08.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "things won't stop evolving, I expect in practice we'll get happy eyeball v3', v3'', etc.
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:17:57.000Z"}, {"author": "Tommy Pauly", "text": "I don't think we can make people implement it one place or the other...
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:18:27.000Z"}, {"author": "Philipp Tiesel", "text": "@jordi I don't see that for linux\u2026 whishfull thinking rarely brought us anywhere
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:19:46.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "I think the greatest value of HEv3 is in (1) reminding people of all the other RFCs they need to comply with, (2) identifying some workarounds for broken/weird configs, and (3) providing a vocabulary for talking about the connection process.
\nWith all of those things in place, the actual algorithm is pretty trivial and is not where the value is.
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:20:19.000Z"}, {"author": "Lars Eggert", "text": "I nominate this as the HE3 logo: https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/kingdomhearts/images/f/f3/LGM_KHIII.png/revision/latest?cb=20200312040146
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:22:23.000Z"}, {"author": "Mike English", "text": ":eyes:
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:25:29.000Z"}, {"author": "Mike English", "text": ":slight_smile:
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:25:59.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "\"deterministic, no side effects\" sounds like the small print on a medicine advert :joy:
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:26:19.000Z"}, {"author": "Brian Trammell", "text": "(side quest for the WG: get a three-eyeballs-looking emoji added to Unicode)
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:26:33.000Z"}, {"author": "Tommy Pauly", "text": "Deterministic medicine sounds... concerning
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:26:35.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "Stochastic medicine is also not reassuring
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:26:58.000Z"}, {"author": "Mike English", "text": "talk to your optometrist to see if mozilla/happy-eyeballs is right for you
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:26:59.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "https://simpsons.fandom.com/wiki/Blinky
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:27:28.000Z"}, {"author": "Tommy Pauly", "text": "This is great, Max! Looking forward to seeing telemetry
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:28:25.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "good work, would love to dig into the telemtry but not enough time
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:28:49.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "does firfox support the concept of origin trials?
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:30:39.000Z"}, {"author": "Lars Eggert", "text": "We ARE open source, you know. PRs welcome, Eric.
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:31:06.000Z"}, {"author": "Brian Trammell", "text": "+1, firefox telemetry has always been a fascinating rabbithole
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:31:07.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "A hash is not an encryption algorithm???
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:44:37.000Z"}, {"author": "Max Inden", "text": "\n\ndoes firfox support the concept of origin trials?
\n
@lucas Firefox does support origin trials That said, I don't think we would offer it for HEv3 given the amount of effort involved.
\nhttps://wiki.mozilla.org/Origin_Trials
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:44:44.000Z"}, {"author": "Brian Carpenter", "text": "@Ben, there are non-crypto hashes, yes. e.g. RFC9923
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:46:32.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "I meant that this is a very weak obfuscation that does not seem to accomplish the privacy goal
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:47:09.000Z"}, {"author": "Tim Chown", "text": "10 mins left so locking q to allow wrap up time
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:49:38.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "There's always UDP...
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:54:45.000Z"}, {"author": "Brian Carpenter", "text": "@chairs, please upload Max's slides to the agenda, thanks
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:55:08.000Z"}, {"author": "xiejieling", "text": "If I use ping for a domain name, when send a dns query timeout it can retry 3 times after how is the TTL of ping determined then the TTL data for ping result is not right
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:55:09.000Z"}, {"author": "Benjamin Schwartz", "text": "SCONE seems to think that UDP is sufficient for Client<->Path signals...
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:56:02.000Z"}, {"author": "Lucas Pardue", "text": "\"Distribute NEL policies with DNS\"
\nhttps://github.com/w3c/network-error-logging/issues/173#issuecomment-1839433018
", "time": "2026-03-18T02:56:52.000Z"}, {"author": "Philipp Tiesel", "text": "For the enterprise use case, just adding \"hey, IPv6/QUIC keeps failing\" to the system logging service would already be very useful
", "time": "2026-03-18T03:04:34.000Z"}, {"author": "Max Inden", "text": "https://www.happy-eyeballs.net/
", "time": "2026-03-18T03:04:36.000Z"}, {"author": "Max Inden", "text": "Happy Eyeball tester Eric is mentioning
", "time": "2026-03-18T03:04:46.000Z"}, {"author": "KHAN Md", "text": "hey @Max Inden , really enjoyed the Firefox talk! you mentioned having some trouble on macOS and Windows 10 right now, what's going on there? are there bugs filed or is it still being figured out?
", "time": "2026-03-18T03:04:58.000Z"}, {"author": "Tommy Pauly", "text": "Thanks!
", "time": "2026-03-18T03:05:15.000Z"}]![https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/kingdomhearts/images/f/f3/LGM_KHIII.png/revision/latest?cb=20200312040146](\"https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/kingdomhearts/images/f/f3/LGM_KHIII.png/revision/latest?cb=20200312040146\"){kind=link}