More important to check for us unusual suspects.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:01:10Z"}, {"author": "Alexey Melnikov", "text": "I can't possibly know what I don't know ;-)
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:01:45Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "My first ever interim. No wise cracks, please.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:06:11Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=draft-ietf-emailcore-rfc5321bis-36 makes life easy
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:07:30Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "The differences between our lists were due to human error AFAICT, not because there was something obscure going on. That points to leaving them alone.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:11:06Z"}, {"author": "Dave Crocker", "text": "an alternative is to introduce a construct like xHLO and declare it to map to both.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:11:32Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "@Dave: I think that leads to the same problem: We might screw up where we introduce that.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:12:59Z"}, {"author": "Dave Crocker", "text": ":sunglasses:
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:13:17Z"}, {"author": "John Klensin", "text": "My goal, going back to the first interaction with Donald, was that we not do anything that makes things worse -- by human error or otherwise.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:13:19Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Is it time to inject \"It's worse than you think?\"
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:13:34Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Agree with \"riskier\", not worth it.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:14:57Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "Meh. Leave it alone.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:15:03Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "+1 LGTM
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:19:15Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "(as a participant)
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:19:27Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I slightly prefer Dave's, though change \"piece of mail\" to \"message\" to be consistent with the rest of the paragraph.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:21:49Z"}, {"author": "John Klensin", "text": "Barry +1 but very slightly)
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:26:13Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "I vaguely remember the discussion from 1999 that introduced that sentence, but cannot find anything in the DRUMS archive about when it happened.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:26:54Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "How many versions of the DRUMS draft were there?
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:27:40Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Probably a pain to check all of them.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:27:47Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "The datatracker might do well with a \"blame\".
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:27:53Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Yep.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:28:31Z"}, {"author": "John Klensin", "text": "Murray: a bunch. And my notes about specific controversies in putting what became 2821 together do not identify any arguments about it.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:28:58Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I think I prefer (2) because (1) and the original have a dangling \"if\". What if the content does not conform to ...? What alternatives are there?
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:35:01Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "\"complete or for\" in the last line seems like a typo.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:36:22Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "completely or for
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:36:30Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "I think strike the \"or\"
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:36:41Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I think it's right as is, or maybe add a comma after \"completely\"
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:37:13Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "\"Whatevah\", as my NY friends would say.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:38:31Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Missing commas can be very important.
\nPete finds inspiration in cooking his family and his dog.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:39:24Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "\"completely or, specifically, for...\"
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:39:28Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "Yes, that works for my soft brain which misread it the first time.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:40:01Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I'd be fine with being explicit about STARTTLS and maybe AUTH, and kicking DKIM and SPF to the AS.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:42:58Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "@Murray: +1
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:43:18Z"}, {"author": "Todd Herr", "text": "starting to???
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:44:58Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "The \"Extensions ...\" sentence is incomplete. Did I write that? ugh.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:47:33Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "There's an \"are\" missing, I think.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:47:37Z"}, {"author": "John Klensin", "text": "Replace bolded text with an explicit \"There is additional discussion of this in the applicability statement\" or something like that?
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:47:50Z"}, {"author": "John Klensin", "text": "I agree with Dave.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:49:20Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "That's a good point. Then I suggest we try without, but be willing to add STARTTLS if cornered.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:49:34Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Shipping a protocol document from ART that has no transport security capability will draw ire from UTA too. :)
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:51:41Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Can we get away with making allusions to \"a future applicability statement\" without making it a normative reference?
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:52:32Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "@Murray: As John said, already mentioned.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:52:47Z"}, {"author": "Barry Leiba", "text": "I think it doesn't need to be normative.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:52:48Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Works for me.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:52:57Z"}, {"author": "Barry Leiba", "text": "Happy to go in the direction JCK just said.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:53:13Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "+1
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:53:48Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Who did John say is pushing DKIM? Karl?
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:54:01Z"}, {"author": "Barry Leiba", "text": "Nooooooooooo
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:54:05Z"}, {"author": "Kenneth Murchison", "text": "our charter says the following about the A/S: \"5321bis and 5322bis will be submitted for
\npublication before this document is finalized\"
I'm fine with defending our preferred text to the IESG.
\nI also suggest we should think about a backup plan we can live with in case that doesn't work.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:58:52Z"}, {"author": "Todd Herr", "text": "@pete - Did you say \"MUST use STARTTLS is a a hill we want to die on\"?
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:59:02Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "@Todd: Yes, we do not want to add that to the document.
", "time": "2024-12-03T16:59:35Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I think this is another case where we can talk about end-to-end security being a common concern for which solutions exist, go do your homework.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:00:57Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "+1 to \"punt to AS\"
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:02:29Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "+1 to this plan
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:06:16Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "+1 to John's suggestion for 5321bis and interim only for the a/s.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:06:36Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Could we even do the AS-focused interim later in December?
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:06:43Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "We may need the interim to deal with IESG pushback on 5321bis.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:09:09Z"}, {"author": "Barry Leiba", "text": "Getting a January interim on our calendars now... might be best.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:11:28Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "@Alexey: Fair. An a/s interim sounds good.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:11:45Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "+1 for cluster
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:12:02Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Two interims might be necessary (one AS, one bis).
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:12:14Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "Both in January is fine.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:12:22Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "ack
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:12:23Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I would love to get all three of these done (in the RFC Editor queue) before I step down, but that's certainly not a hard requirement.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:12:45Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "I love happy thoughts!
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:15:32Z"}, {"author": "Murray Kucherawy", "text": "I'll have what he's having.
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:15:39Z"}, {"author": "Pete Resnick", "text": "@Murray: Now that's a good reference!
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:16:03Z"}, {"author": "Kenneth Murchison", "text": "Bye all. Enjoy your holidays!
", "time": "2024-12-03T17:18:25Z"}]