Network Time Protocols (ntp) working group - June 2024 Virtual Interim

Thursday, 06 June 2024
17:00 - 18:30 UTC
(via meetecho - link TBS)

Draft Agenda

WGLC has been issued
Discussion between NTP/IETF and IEEE about what the NTP/IETF can
specify
Miroslav has updated the draft with suggestions from the PTP
WG@IEEE. The new document will be submitted to the IESG at the end
of the week if nobody files a objections.
Note: Participation at IEEE working groups is not open fpr the
public. However access can be granted and documents can be provided
if necessary. Contact Karen or Dieter.

WGLC is ambigious
Dieter: Requirements language is used extensively for an
informational draft. Usage of MUST should be evaluated.
Chairs intend to discuss this also with the AD
James: wants to consider usage of requirements language only case by
case
James: This draft is mentioned as a milestone in the charter.
Karen: we will find a way to move this forward together with the AD

Editorial changes
Discussion on the authentication messages
David will provide an update
Miroslav will submit a new version before IETF 120
David: first implementations are working without problem. The design
seems to be ok

Watson: will upload a new draft with small changes before IETF 120.
Please provide comments.

Martin: Is working on the implementations. He has some notes about
necessary changes to the document. He intends to shorten the
document.
Martin: Regarding the current discussion. We think that we can
secure PTP on the basis of the authentication TLV; however, this is
not without its problems.
David: Don't see a good way to work on the basis of the current
autentication TLV. BMCA can be attacked quite easily.
Martin: we can protect packet exchange. This will not solve any
problem but will increase security.
David: Protection individual messages is not enough. The logical
functions should also be protected.
Kristof: Do understand that it feels bad to increase security a bit
and advertise this later on. The same thing with GNSS; but it is
still good to have signatures on the messages.
Miroslav: It is always possible to have NTP service in order to
protect against delay attacks.
Karen: 2019 IEEE 1588 specification the Security Annex has 4 prongs
because the group didn't find the one approach which solved all
problems. NTS for PTP is probably also a piece to enhance security
of PTP. We cannot change the basic approach in the IETF.
Dieter: The introduction of a section clarifying the objectives of
the document would be helpful.
Martin: Agree to introduce a goal's section.
Kristof: In security subgroup of P1588 and also in Kristof focus was
already protecting the message exchange.
Karen: a call between IETF and IEEE on security architecture on 20th
June, 1600 UTC.

Hackathon in Vancouver?
- Possible for Watson for Roughtime
- Karen: will issue a call in the mailing list