Minutes IETF101: mboned
minutes-101-mboned-00

IETF 101 London
MBONED Agenda
Tues, Mar 20, 2018
9:30AM-12PM
1E Park Suite (Held jointly with PIM WG)

Note taker: Brian Adamson/Justin Dean

Etherpad notes: https://etherpad.tools.ietf.org/p/notes-ietf-101-mboned
Jabber Log: https://www.ietf.org/jabber/logs/mboned/2018-03-20.html
Audio log: https://ietf.org/audio/ietf101/ietf101-parksuite-20180320-0930.mp3
Video log: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-APQy9ZiTBo

MBONED notes:
    Note Well
    Agenda and agenda bashing no comments
    Status of Active WG Docs:
        mboned-mtrace-v2-21 updated draft due to DISCUSS security issues raised
        mboned-ieee802-mcast-problems-01 adoped since last wg and merged two
        drafts into one mboned-multicast-info-model-02 updated ready for
        adoption? mboned-multicast-models-02 wasn't ready for adoption
        previously was trimed down and may be ready soon
    Deprecating ASM for interdomain Multicast
        Tim Chown (Presenter)
        mboned-deprecate-interdomain-asm-00
        Presented the high-level statement - does anyone have any issues with
        it?  If so please come to the microphone. (Slide6) Stig: did you
        depreprecate RP completely or still use it within a domain? Tim/Lenny:
        We are just saying don't use it for interdomain What is the state of
        interdomain multicast?  How much is actually in use? Lenny: We will be
        able to answer that better in the next presentation Stig: You might
        want to call this out if its about random people or domains that are
        closely related ?: I think we should call out that it's between
        differently run domains not domains run by a single entity Tim: Who has
        read the new draft?  2 hands raised Lenny: Of the people who have read
        it or have been paying attention who would support adoption?  ~8 hands
        raised Lenny: against?  0 hands.  We will take it to the list but seems
        a go. Lenny: anyone have any comments on the 3 other Rob Evans: do we
        need the asm to ssm maping?  It seems like a lot of work for very
        limited use. Jake Holland: There is legacy hardware that supports
        IGMPv2 but won't work without the mapping. Michael: technical
        disscussion about MLDV2, s,joins ?: It will take a while to get rid of
        ASM applications if we ever do so it might be okay to do the mapping
        method Tim: mapping meant to be an interim method; such things do have
        a habit of persisting though Jake: Are there examples BCP about
        converting applications that we have to work off of? Tim: Not that I'm
        aware of. Jake: That might be something I can help with.
    Public AMT Relay Deployment on the MBONE Experience
        William Zhang (Presenter)
        Jake Holland: Further work slide.  The problem with Web Assembly is
        that there is no UDP support so you are going to have a problem with
        that.  If you want to persue this there was a hackathon project as a
        wrapper for UDP.  Should consider this approach Lucas Pardue: I was
        also working with Jake on the hackathon.  We were working on getting
        quic working in the web browser.  Threading is also an issue.  There
        are also issues on how you'd impliment this as a web app.  We ended up
        using web sockets. Rob Evans: As well as sweeping active sources did
        you look at sap or sdp? Lenny: No we only really looked at active
        sources not sap/sdp announcements.  There is traffic on the SAP group
        so someone is using it but we didn't look at that. Rob Evans:
        Meteorological data comes in EUMETSAT which I find interesting to find
        on the I2 network Lenny: Another interesting thing about EUMETSAT is
        that they were one of the few to use SSM. Lenny: The original goal of
        AMT is to have end users access multicast content but the gateway
        capabilities seem to be more focused on networking devices (not hosts).
         Any assistance from people would be helpful.  Updating VLC with AMT GW
        might be nice Jake: One more suggestion of AMT resources there is a
        cisco vm that has AMT support that can be downloaded.  Do we know if
        these groups are joinable by asm or ssm?

    Multicast Yang Model
        Sandy Zhang (Presenter)
        WG adoption?
        Lenny: Who has read the updated draft? 2 hands
        Lenny: Other folks in the room we did get comments back from the yang
        doctors seemed like supporting it.  Who in the room would support
        addoption?  ~5 hands raised. Jake Holland: Thank you for the update it
        was one of the more readable YANG documents that I've read.

    Multicast in the Data Center
        Mike McBride (Presenter)
        It would be good to get an update.  I'd love to work with someone to
        udate the draft it's already a wg draft so it would be an easy way to
        get your name on a draft for any interested/capable persons.

    Multicast vs WiFi
        Charlie Perkins (Presenter)
        Jake Holland: section 4.5 of the draft I would like to see filled out. 
        In the draft I would love to see how that works. Michael: I've seen
        devices where you turn on ip snooping and it turns off all other
        ethernet multicast. Lenny: There is an IGMP snooping draft and I'm
        pretty sure it doesn't say turn off multicast. Michael: But is there a
        draft that says don't do that.  This isn't just a wireless issue as
        some wired devices do this.  Should we only focus on 802 or include
        things like this in the wired world. Perkins: I think this draft should
        focus on wireless. Alvero: Joel asked what should the IETF do.  IT
        would be really nice if part of the output from the WG produces this
        answer.  Because I saw the section on the presentation which asked that
        question but I would find it useful to have some output from the WG to
        answer that question. Perkins: There were some comments from Joel on
        the list but those comments haven't been incorportated into the draft. 
        There will be a new revision of the draft within 2 weeks.